Content-Type: message/rfc822 Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2006 15:05:31 -0400 From: "jansymello" To: "Vladimir Nabokov Forum" Cc: Subject: Re: [NABOKV-L] On symmetry II Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=__Part3511606B.1__=" --=__Part3511606B.1__= Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=__Part3511606B.2__=" --=__Part3511606B.2__= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear Anthony Stadlen and Penny McC, A.Stadlen answered my comment on symmetry and narcissistic characters: " I never said this. Of course there are beautiful symmetries in nature and art and mathematics, and real circularities as in Finnegans Wake and VN's circular short story. But there are also unreliable ones proposed by unreliable people, such as some of VN's narrators, who try to reduce otherness to sameness. I misread your statements and generalized what had been limited to a special context. Sorry. I had the impression you ascribed symmetry (and "obsessive patterning") mainly to VN's unreliable narrators and not to VN himself. Stadlen wrote: " VN did (in Strong Opinions, or was it Lectures on Literature, or Speak Memory, or perhaps all three?) praise the Hegelian-dialectical spiral as something that meant much to him. That is something different from either symmetry or circularity." I'm a bit confused with what the term "symmetry" means: If someone with mathematical abilities could correct me here: I don't think Symmetry only applies to mirror-like reflections or doublings. Wouldn't the regularities of, say, a spiral shell or caracole or any helicoidals represent one kind of "symmetry"? Stephen, I think the philosopher Epicurus was a monist and an "atomist" ( I suppose VN read Lucrecius and "De Rerum Natura"?) and this is why I mentioned VN's sentence on Van as "an epicure of duration" in the context of "monism", while hoping someone would take up this matter and add more information to my scant notions. After all "a-tomism" could mean something related to what was suggested by VN's description of himself as an "undivided monist". Jansy ----- Original Message ----- From: Anthony Stadlen To: NABOKV-L@LISTSERV.UCSB.EDU Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 11:31 AM Subject: Re: [NABOKV-L] On symmetry II In a message dated 28/09/2006 14:29:00 GMT Standard Time, dorazander@TERRA.COM.BR writes: A. Stadlen asked: "As a general rule, is it not crucial not to fall for the symmetries and circularities proposed by self-absorbed narcissists like Hermann and Kinbote? A large part of VN's challenge to the reader is not to be seduced by such unreliable (to put it absurdly mildly) narrators..." I'm curious to learn why A.Stadlen thinks that "symmetries and circularities" are merely the ones we find in VN's "self-absorbed narcissists" ( A.Appel.Jr. discussed this in relation to "an escape from solipsism"). Jansy But I don't think so.VN did (in Strong Opinions, or was it Lectures on Literature, or Speak Memory, or perhaps all three?) praise the Hegelian-dialectical spiral as something that meant much to him. That is something different from either symmetry or circularity. Anthony Stadlen Search the Nabokv-L archive at UCSB Contact the Editors All private editorial communications, without exception, are read by both co-editors. Visit Zembla View Nabokv-L Policies Search the archive: http://listserv.ucsb.edu/archives/nabokv-l.html Contact the Editors: mailto:nabokv-l@utk.edu,nabokv-l@holycross.edu Visit Zembla: http://www.libraries.psu.edu/nabokov/zembla.htm View Nabokv-L policies: http://web.utk.edu/~sblackwe/EDNote.htm Search the archive: http://listserv.ucsb.edu/archives/nabokv-l.html Contact the Editors: mailto:nabokv-l@utk.edu,nabokv-l@holycross.edu Visit Zembla: http://www.libraries.psu.edu/nabokov/zembla.htm View Nabokv-L policies: http://web.utk.edu/~sblackwe/EDNote.htm --=__Part3511606B.2__= Content-Type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: HTML
Dear Anthony Stadlen and Penny McC,
 
A.Stadlen answered my comment on symmetry and narcissistic characters: " I never said this. Of course there are beautiful symmetries in nature and art and mathematics, and real circularities as in Finnegans Wake and VN's circular short story. But there are also unreliable ones proposed by unreliable people, such as some of VN's narrators, who try to reduce otherness to sameness.
 
I misread your statements and generalized what had been limited to a special context. Sorry. 
I had the impression you ascribed symmetry (and "obsessive patterning") mainly to VN's unreliable narrators and not to VN himself.    
 
Stadlen wrote: " VN did (in Strong Opinions, or was it Lectures on Literature, or Speak Memory, or perhaps all three?) praise the Hegelian-dialectical spiral as something that meant much to him. That is something different from either symmetry or circularity."  
I'm a bit confused with what the term "symmetry" means:  If someone with mathematical abilities could correct me here: I don't think Symmetry only applies to mirror-like reflections or doublings. Wouldn't the regularities of, say, a spiral shell or caracole or any helicoidals represent one kind of "symmetry"?
 
Stephen, I think the philosopher Epicurus was a monist and an "atomist" (  I suppose VN read Lucrecius and "De Rerum Natura"?) and this is why I mentioned VN's sentence on Van as "an epicure of duration" in the context of "monism", while  hoping someone would take up this matter and add more information to my scant notions. 
After all "a-tomism" could mean something related to what was suggested by VN's description of himself as an  "undivided monist".
Jansy
----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Stadlen
To: NABOKV-L@LISTSERV.UCSB.EDU
Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 11:31 AM
Subject: Re: [NABOKV-L] On symmetry II

In a message dated 28/09/2006 14:29:00 GMT Standard Time, dorazander@TERRA.COM.BR writes:
A. Stadlen asked: "As a general rule, is it not crucial not to fall for the symmetries and circularities proposed by self-absorbed narcissists like Hermann and Kinbote? A large part of VN's challenge to the reader is not to be seduced by such unreliable (to put it absurdly mildly) narrators..."   I'm curious to learn  why A.Stadlen thinks that "symmetries and circularities" are merely the ones we find in VN's "self-absorbed narcissists" ( A.Appel.Jr. discussed this in relation to "an escape from solipsism").
 
Jansy 
But I don't think so.VN did (in Strong Opinions, or was it Lectures on Literature, or Speak Memory, or perhaps all three?) praise the Hegelian-dialectical spiral as something that meant much to him. That is something different from either symmetry or circularity.
 
Anthony Stadlen          

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